Crazy Wisdom
Episode #444: The Hidden Frameworks of the Internet: Knowledge Graphs, Ontologies, and Who Controls Truth
- AI & Agents
- Knowledge & Learning
- Libraries
- knowledge management
- taxonomy
- ontology
- information architecture
- Internet Archive
- digital preservation
- public access
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Timestamps
Jessica explains how libraries have historically shifted between public and private control, shaping access to knowledge and democracy.
Stewart describes visiting the Internet Archive post-cyberattack, sparking a discussion on threats to digital preservation and free information.
Jessica breaks down how AI trains on structured data from sources like NIH and PubMed but often lacks alignment with authoritative knowledge.
They explore how linked data enables machines to understand connections between knowledge, referencing the vision behind the semantic web.
Jessica explains how libraries are transitioning from cataloging books to managing entities, ensuring provenance and verifiable knowledge.
Stewart compares today’s deletion of digital content to historical knowledge loss, warning about the fragility of digital memory.
They discuss how knowledge suppression—from book bans to algorithmic censorship—threatens free access to information.
Jessica highlights how AI and search engines depend on structured metadata but often fail to prioritize authoritative sources.
They debate the battle between corporations, governments, and open-source efforts to control how knowledge is structured and accessed.
Jessica emphasizes that librarians and structured knowledge systems are essential in combating misinformation in AI.
They reflect on whether AI and linked data will expand knowledge access or accelerate digital decay and misinformation.
Key Insights
- The Evolution of Libraries Reflects Power Struggles Over Knowledge: Libraries have historically oscillated between being public and private institutions, reflecting broader societal shifts in who controls access to knowledge. Jessica Talisman highlights how figures like Andrew Carnegie helped establish the modern public library system, reinforcing libraries as democratic spaces where information is accessible to all. However, she also notes that as knowledge becomes digitized, new battles emerge over who owns and controls digital information.
- The Internet Archive Faces Systematic Attacks on Knowledge: Stewart Alsop shares his firsthand experience visiting the Internet Archive just after it had suffered a major cyberattack. This incident is part of a larger trend in which libraries and knowledge repositories worldwide, including those in Canada, have been targeted. The conversation raises concerns that these attacks are not random but part of a broader, well-funded effort to undermine access to information.
- AI and Knowledge Graphs Are Deeply Intertwined: AI systems, particularly large language models (LLMs), rely on structured data sources such as knowledge graphs, ontologies, and linked data. Talisman explains how institutions like the NIH and PubMed provide openly available, structured knowledge that AI systems train on. Yet, she points out a critical gap—AI often lacks alignment with real-world, authoritative sources, which leads to inaccuracies in machine-generated knowledge.
- Libraries Are Moving From Cataloging to Entity Management: Traditional library systems were built around cataloging books and documents, but modern libraries are transitioning toward entity management, which organizes knowledge in a way that allows for more dynamic connections. Linked data and knowledge graphs enable this shift, making it easier to navigate vast repositories of information while maintaining provenance and authority.
- The War on Truth and Information Is Accelerating: The episode touches on the increasing threats to truth and reliable information, from book bans to algorithmic suppression of knowledge. Talisman underscores the crucial role librarians play in preserving access to primary sources and maintaining records of historical truth. As AI becomes more prominent in knowledge dissemination, the need for robust, verifiable sources becomes even more urgent.
- Linked Data is the Foundation of Digital Knowledge: The conversation explores how linked data protocols, such as those championed by Tim Berners-Lee, allow machines and AI to interpret and connect information across the web. Talisman explains that institutions like NIH publish their taxonomies in RDF format, making them accessible as structured, authoritative sources. However, many organizations fail to leverage this interconnected data, leading to inefficiencies in knowledge management.
- Preserving Digital Memory is a Civilization-Defining Challenge: In the digital age, the loss of information is more severe than ever. Alsop compares the current state of digital impermanence to the Dark Ages, where crucial knowledge risks disappearing due to corporate decisions, cyberattacks, and lack of preservation infrastructure. Talisman agrees, emphasizing that digital archives like the Internet Archive, WorldCat, and Wikimedia are foundational to maintaining a collective human memory.
Episode transcript
Welcome to the Crazy Wisdom Podcast. This podcast is for you. If you have an insane drive to find the truth of things, it's not the good answers that we seek, but the good questions. I interview a range of different guests from many different fields, all with the intention to uncover the simple truths that are hidden in plain sight. Most people don't want to go there. I go there, my guests go there, and you benefit. Please let me know if you enjoy these episodes and as always, subscribe on itunes, Spotify, or wherever you listen to the podcasts.
Welcome to the Crazy Wisdom Podcast. My guest today is Jessica Talisman, and she is building information systems for the benefit of all. Taxonomy, ontology, and knowledge management. And she's also a senior information architect. Welcome to the show.
Right before we were recording, we were talking about, well, I want to talk about the history of the library. What is the most interesting fact or arc of the evolution of the library? There is this great book that I read called Library of Fragile History, but I only got up until the 1500s or the 1600s. What's the most interesting thing you know about libraries?
They've flipped. I think this is something people don't realize is throughout the arc or the history of time, because libraries, gosh, go back, we can trace them back 3,000 years. And what's wild is that they vacillate between going public and private. And that really speaks to the nature of knowledge and politics and society. And so what I find fascinating is the most recent in American history at least, is Carnegie. We can thank Carnegie for creating these public libraries, kind of the common and current version of libraries in our society. And really within the librarian space, libraries are the last bastion of freedom and democracy because it's a free, open space where expression is welcome, people can have community meetings. But also there's a lot of learning that happens in those spaces as well, and resources that are made available to all factions of society. So from the kid that needs WI fi access to do their homework, to, like, someone looking for a job, to, like, even homeless. And I think that's, you know, it's that sort of equal playing field, you know, and we see that represented when people want to get their library card. You know, that's a free thing. That's a free service. And an issue so much is, like, if you don't have a birth certificate, how do you get a library card? Like, making things accessible, organized, structured, and equaling that playing field.
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